DISQUS

Ken · 4 years ago

Of course the whole idea that British people are frightened of, or hostile to, Europe or European people is misplaced. As we Eusceptics keep repeating Europe is not the EU, for as much as people like Kampfner and the pro EU camp generally, keep interchanging Europe and EU, there is a difference the majority are quite happy to trade with holiday in exchange goods etc with Europe, but want to be governed by our own government in Westminster. If the pro EU camp would just take this on board it would save a lot of trees.

Alex · 4 years ago

No, we have to keep repeating it because it is necessary to resist the isolationist nonsense that EU withdrawal/quasi-withdrawal is cost free. The available non-EU Europe shrinks daily. Are you down to just Switzerland yet? Not quite: there's always Norway. And Serbia (the rest of the Balkans will be in soon enough), as well as a couple of risible tax paradise postage stamps.

EFTA is no longer a viable concept, if it ever was. Empire Free Trade is a 1930s idea, not today. These Napoleonic fantasies of a counter-EU ought frankly to be one with the nationalisation of the machine tool industry and an increased supply of domestic servants. An ex-EU Britain would face steady pressure to erode the terms of trade with the EU, with little counter-leverage. We are either in or out.

EU Serf · 4 years ago

I know that there are very few other arguments in favour of the socialist nightmare that is rule by Brussels, but this anti EU = Xenophobia rubbish is constantly being repeated. Its supposed to be our side that propagates the myths.

We Eurosceptics have many reasons to hate the EU, CAP, CFP, 80.000 pages of regulation, Billions of pounds in taxes and Mr Chirac to name just a few. I personally hate the lack of understanding on the continent of the proper role of the state (a misunderstanding shared by our dear leader TB).

The idea that we need to be controlled and told what to do in every area of our lives is insulting as well as morally wrong. The idea that all laws across Europe have to be the same is ignorant beyond belief. If the EU stood for liberty and not the road to harmonised state allowed lifestyles, you might find more Brits being in favour.

Instead it all about compromise by politicians who believe in nothing other than the propagation of their own power.

All we need is free trade and free movement of people. Everything else is an expensive limit on our freedom.

Ken · 4 years ago

"No, we have to keep repeating it because it is necessary to resist the isolationist nonsense that EU withdrawal/quasi-withdrawal is cost free."

You have to keep repeating a falsehood? To resist what? There is no basis for your suggestion that Eusceptics are isolationist, that is another lie, or that withdrawal is not cost free that is another lie. In a short sentence you compound Kampfner’s misdirection by adding more of you own.

Tim Worstall · 4 years ago

One for the Ranter.
Leaving the EU would be an immediate benefit of 25 billion a year in our trade. Patrick Minford’s written a whole book on it.

Alex · 4 years ago

It'll be the words "Patrick" and "Minford" that wreck that for me...